He'd have used his bird spies to scour the area and sent out Uruks on wargs and men on horses. Middle-earth & J.R.R. Despite an erratic and feeble end, for long he was one of the wise, and for long desired the ring; he could not possibly have failed to consider Sauron's response. the scene in which Gandalf, say, was placed in such a position. 2) Saurman is defeated by Sauron and the ring is taken from him, destroying Saruman's mind. If Saruman destroyed Sauron If he won, he would become a great L. . By the time of The Lord of the Rings, Saruman has become jealous of Sauron's power (and Gandalf's too). Remember, the greater part of Saurons strength was poured into the ring. Even if Theoden triumphed at Helm's Deep in this scenario, Saruman would be relatively safe in Isengard and Aragorn would not be able to look into the Palantir which is what led Sauron to focus his attention in Aragorn's direction and not around his own borders. The one ring would have made him more like what he was before he left on his mission to middle-earth, only corrupted and evil. Site design / logo 2023 Stack Exchange Inc; user contributions licensed under CC BY-SA. In Middle-earth history, it seems likely Saruman arrived before Gandalf did. He aided Frodo but he did not save him or the Quest from certain ruin as Eomer did by attacking the orc band. So it's possible that someone of sufficient power could break the Rings bond to Sauron. Sauron was not a run of the mill foe and an ordinary blade wielded by an ordinary man would not have sufficed. First of all: Yes, you probably should watch at least The Two Towers before reading much further: that movie is all about Saruman's plans and schemes.. Having said that, there's a combination of things that have driven Saruman to act the way he does in the Lord of the Rings trilogy. Although this is never explicitly stated, Galadriel alluded to the Fact that Gandalf, . Although Saruman had selfish motives, he didn't expect to fall so deep . Do you want to be the first who gets the news directly to your mailbox? Learn more about Stack Overflow the company, and our products. Well what DID the Ring do for Sauron? Who is more popular Leonardo DiCaprio or Tom Cruise? As mentioned, the Valar sent the Istari (who are Maiar spirits) to Middle-earth. I'm a little vague on this point. Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience. Around 500 years before The Lord of the Rings, the White Council was formed in Rivendell -- a group for Middle-earth's most powerful beings to discuss Sauron.Galadriel wanted Gandalf to take the head position, but Saruman insisted that he be in charge because of his status. What about Galadrial? [ST:TNG] The First Duty what if there had been no accident? However, Gandalf knew that if he being an extremely powerful Maiar just like Sauron had taken the One Ring, he would become no different than the Dark Lord. That was a lucky hitand did you perhaps notice that Sauron was more or less single-handedly beating the entire Last Alliance army at that point? Had Isuldur done the wise thing, and pitched that sucker in the crack of doom, that would have been it. I know Letter 246 says Sauron himself did not fear the Ring, would not have hesitated to confront a Ring-wielding Frodo, and could easily have forced Frodo to hand the Ring over. New Movie News, Movie Trailers & upcoming Movie Reviews, Saruman Gaining the One Ring Would Have Doomed Middle-earth Even Faster, Thranduil Was a Jerk - But Lord of the Rings' Only Dark Elf Was Actually Evil, How Morgoth Created Glaurung and The Lord of the Rings' Dragons, REVIEW: Frank Miller Presents Ancient Enemies: The Djinni #1 Crafts a Compelling Origin Story, REVIEW: DC's Shazam! Gandalf wasn't even sure if he would be able to break his staff in The Return of the King, and that was a very weakened version of Saruman. Basically it took a super-human with a super-sword to chop the ring off of Sauron's hand and he only did that with a lucky hit. Does this sword yield more power than the ring? Either way, the good guys loose big. If he didn't get the Truth from Saruman, he could get it from the halflings and if they were dead due to Saruman, capture and question any of Saruman's orcs or men roaming between Isengard and the Black Gate. You also have the option to opt-out of these cookies. Instead of sending armies out to take Minas Tirith, Sauron would have had the majority of his forces concentrated on his borders and sweeping the land in front of it with orcs, men, trolls, and Nazgul. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. We dont know if the Stranger will make it to his destination and the show could certainly deviate from lore or invent new history ( as it has done already). Do new devs get fired if they can't solve a certain bug? Still, this is a point to consider. He sees the Dark Lord as a rival and also an aspiration. The cookie is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Other. You must log in or register to reply here. Please message us if we have not credited you! The content on this site is for entertainment and educational purposes only. Let's first look at what would happen if Saruman succeeded, and then at his strategy for defeating Sauron. Well Gandalf and Galadriel were pretty confident in their ability to defeat Sauron using One Ring! Analytical cookies are used to understand how visitors interact with the website. The Lord of the Rings. But what does Saruman do now? Gandalf found out that Saruman had abandoned his mission when the White Wizard asked him to join forces with Sauron. The three created majesty of a different sort, and magnified the loyalty of those who already were loyal, rather than coercing by fear. The White Wizard -- at the height of his power -- could have been a match for the Ringless Dark Lord. The Eye of Sauron is one of the most iconic symbols associated with J.R.R. Is he stronger than the will of the ring? That means Frodo had to destroy the Ring to destroy Sauron for good. How long before Sauron wrung out the truth from Saruman? The cookie is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Analytics". So, it seems Sauron is not invincible, even with the ring, much less against it. Sauron then spends the rest of his life torturing Saruman for daring to try and take the ring for himself. He would have learned what very few people knew - the actual objective of the Quest of the Ring, that it was being taken to Mt. Behind Naruto, Gandalf stood straighter, and began to comb his beard with his fingers. If Im not mistaken, he is Vanyar? While Frodo and his companions know that Sauron is an embodiment of . Narsil was no ordinary sword, and the Numenoreans weren't ordinary men either. How successful would Saruman be finding and capturing the Ringbearer in this scenario is speculative but one has to wonder would Sauron not notice this activity. What happens next? He and his servants already knew of his involvement in the attack on the Fellowship and the capture of the hobbits. He easily would have had mastery over the ring itself. Why are trials on "Law & Order" in the New York Supreme Court? Although they did oppose the will of Sauron, while he did not have the one, they were still subject to his will, if he regained it, and all that had been done with them would be revealed. These cookies track visitors across websites and collect information to provide customized ads. rev2023.3.3.43278. The best answers are voted up and rise to the top, Not the answer you're looking for? The cookie is set by GDPR cookie consent to record the user consent for the cookies in the category "Functional". We look at sections of The Lord of the Rings and Tolkien's letters to answer the question - what would happen if Sauron reclaimed The One Ring? The Ring merely corrupted you, it did not control you. If you know how to use it, its an *extremely* powerful magical artifact. Sauron w. Tolkien said of Saruman, also known as Curumo: The first to come was one of noble mien and bearing, with raven hair, and a fair voice, and he was clad in white; great skill he had in works of hand, and he was regarded by well-nigh all, even by the Eldar, as the head of the Order. Nazgul were formidable opponants, under the right circumstances. Other powerul magic users such as Galadriel, Gandalf & Saruman can use the Ring to increase their power as that is what it was forged by Sauron to do, but it will never truly be completely under their will because Sauron's evil will already exists in the Ring. Ultimately, we dont know who the Stranger is, aside from being an Istar, or a wizard. He also had control of the nine kings and such or was supposed to, although didn't Elrond get a ring yet was present at the battle? I suspect that most of us think Saruman's treachery is so fundamental to Lord of the Rings, that it is almost impossible to imagine the epic without it. Naruto turned, and saw a Wizard in all white and an Elven Lady behind him. This just had to be the best designed set, even better than the 2017 UCS Millennium Falcon! He would have also learned where the Fellowship was broken and knowing the Ringbearer's true purpose would assume his destination would be the Black Gate which indeed it was until Gollum convinced Frodo otherwise. In the appendices it mentions the three assaults on Lorien, during the final days of the struggle. If not for Gandalf, Gondor might've fallen to Sauron. He and Nori leave for the land in the east at the end of The Rings of Power season one finale. Saruman volunteered. What if Saruman had never been corrupted? The thing is, that wouldn't be a simple task. Saruman wants to be Saurons only servant. Earlier in the same letter we see just exactly how useful the Ring would have been to a hypothetical Ring-bearing Saruman (or anyone else, for that matter): Sauron would not have feared the Ring! I'm no Tolkien expert but I assume there would have been a great war between Isengard and Mordor, which would have affected all parts of Middle Earth. On the surface, Saruman seems like one of the simplest Lord of the Rings characters to define. And they are similar to, if slightly less powerful than, the Maiar? I also assume that Sauron would have eventually won the war. Saruman is one of few "grey" characters in the books, meaning he's neither gone fully evil or good. On February 26, 3019 Eomer, Third Marshal of the Riddermark, set out against orders from his king to hunt an orc band coming from the east. Advertisement cookies are used to provide visitors with relevant ads and marketing campaigns. To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers. Why are Suriname, Belize, and Guinea-Bissau classified as "Small Island Developing States"? Balrogs are intelligent sentient beings. When the White Council was formed around T.A. Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0, TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History, Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News. A place where magic is studied and practiced? Create an account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations. We dont know any details about his activities in Rhn or his other easterly travels. The situation in The Lord of the Rings was pretty dire. Tolkien says in Letter 246 that the Ring is not only comparable to "a devastating weapon" (which Frodo doesn't know how to use) but also to "an object of terror in their religious cult, by which they had been conditioned to treat one who wielded it with servility". They could not fight him, since it was under Saurons power they were made, but they did distract him - Sauron was concentrating his sight and attantion upon Rivendell and Lothlorien. But what would have happened if things had worked out differently? Hes lost his way in a search for greater power. The Silmarillion says Saruman was the eldest Istari and came first. Hes of the same order of beings as Sauron, so he certainly has enough power to effectively use the ring. What would happen if a Barrow-wight had taken the One Ring and why didn't they? Luckily, Gandalf refused, and the rest of the trilogy didn't play out in Saruman's favor. Also, it says in the book that the Nazgul went to Isengard demanding news of the ring and if Sauraman had the ring, Sauraman said if I had the ring you would bow down to me and call me lord I think Saruman would've won if he captured the ring. 2463, Saruman was appointed its leader.Even then, he had begun to sense the resurgence of Sauron and to envy and desire his power, and especially his One Ring.Coincidentally, in that same year the One Ring was found by the creature Gollum, drawing the Dark Lord closer to the conflict that would eventually prove Saruman's undoing. All of Saruman's scheming nearly came to fruition in The Two Towers. And in The Rings of Power, when the . Is there a single-word adjective for "having exceptionally strong moral principles"? Why does Gollum calling the ring his own not alert Sauron? In fact, he had started searching for the One Ring (and found Isildur's remains) well before the events of The Hobbit. Sauron originally made the One Ring to enhance his ability to influence and suppress or control the wills of other beings, specifically the Children of Ilvatar (Elves, Dwarves, and Men). But what if the Stranger is a different wizard we all know from The Lord of the Rings? Plus, if the Stranger is Saruman, it also makes Gandalfs journey and decisions all the more important and emphasizes an ongoing theme in Tolkiens works: every being has the power to choose between good and evil, or selflessness vs. selfishness. Here's a hypothesis: Yes, Saruman knew the lore of making such rings but not necessarily the technique (as anyone who has tried to recreate an article based on a knitting or crochet pattern found online can tell you!) Saruman knew good and well what would happen when he tried holding Gandalf. 1. Sorry, memory fails me ATM. So He would do what He did after His defeat by Isildur. In the chaos Eomer created, two hobbits managed to escape with the help of a greedy orc and met with an ancient being which in turn led to the ruin of Saruman. Well? They were basically the teachers pet ones who lived closest to the Valar and did not trouble themselves (except once) with the problems of Middle-Earth. I never really understood how they fit into the picture - I presume the nine gave to their bearers some ability, but ultimately corrupted them and turned them into the nazgul, which I guess was their purpose. You are using an out of date browser. He disobeyed his king but he held his loyalty to his people and by doing so he inadvertently saved Middle-Earth. In The Lord of the Rings, the palantri corrupt nearly all who use them. A couple of points to add to the excellent arguments thus far: This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register. By the time we meet Saruman in The Lord of the Rings, hes up to no good. He also used his Palantir to spy on Sauron. Got caught and lost a mind-to-mind battle. It would be difficult for Sauron. Saruman wasnt an elf, or even a man. Orcs are poster children for corruption, and plague the Fellowship throughout the novels. What If SARUMAN managed to get his hands on the One Ring and how that . The Uruk-hai capture Frodo and Sam at Amon Hen, thus Saruman gains possession of the most powerful of the Rings of Power, which carries in it, a greater part of Sauron's inherent might. *shrugs*. You are using an out of date browser. Powered by Discourse, best viewed with JavaScript enabled. Rings of Power (and a touch of Wheel of Time), Ignore/Block Essentials, Paid Registrations by. Stack Exchange network consists of 181 Q&A communities including Stack Overflow, the largest, most trusted online community for developers to learn, share their knowledge, and build their careers. By the time of The Lord of the Rings, Saruman has become jealous of Saurons power (and Gandalfs too). In this scenario, Sauron likely would have recovered his Ring and covered all the lands in a second darkness. In his actual presence none but very few of equal stature could have hoped to withhold it from him. Yet, he had something that needed to be done first. Even from afar he had an effect upon it, to make it work for its return to himself. He reasoned that his total control of Middle . This is what Sauron feared that his enemies would do, if they got the Ring; and that's the only reason he feared them. (OK, just a Numenorean with the largest army and navy in all of history.) He would have been able to control more people, and he would have had a much easier time dominating their wills. If a law is new but its interpretation is vague, can the courts directly ask the drafters the intent and official interpretation of their law? Like the Valar He was created in the Beginning. Even some of the imagery in his scenes screams Gandalf. There would have been one less Peter Jackson movie. Saruman also experimented with the making of a Ring of his own. As was made quite clear at the Council of Elrond, as long as the Ring existed Sauron could not fully be destroyed. Feel free to contact him by email at hawkins.blake12@gmail.com, or find him on Facebook. With possession of the one ring he would have replaced Sauron (would have wiped him out entirely). The orcs likely would have gotten to Isengard the next day or so or met Saruman on the way as he or his image was seen by Aragorn and Company on the evening of the 30th. Imagine that, after breaking of Fellowship, Saruman`s Uruk-Hai capture Frodo and bring him, with the ring, to Isengard. It's much more likely that Saruman would have used the One Ring for himself and tried to claim Middle-earth as his own. The White Wizard put Isengard at Sauron's disposal until his armies were defeated at Helms Deep and his staff was broken by the resurrected Gandalf. But Saruman was always too prideful for his companions. Saruman was Maia like Sauron. Since the One Ring is a part of Sauron it could only ever reach its full power under Sauron's control. By the end of Return of the King, Saruman has lost his powers and has resorted to becoming a lowly criminal. RELATED: The Lord of the Rings: 10 Details About Sauron's Costume You Never Noticed This incident, one of those that was invented for the film to increase tension, is an incredible missed opportunity for the minions of the Dark . Sauron was stronger than Gandalf the Grey, but . All credit must go to the talented artists. . It might be that if Saruman had the Ring he would, in a Maiar way, then become Sauron in the same way. This increased his corruption, though he never lost the possibility of becoming independent with the One Ring. . Unfortunately, Sauron had got on the wrong side of a particularly powerful race: the Nmenreans.The isle of Nmenr was a realm of men that sat apart from Middle-earth and those who lived there were more powerful than the men seen elsewhere in The Lord of . After that there is no other mention of Aragorn and the Ring together. How could Sauron defeat Saruman, or even pay him a visit if he's disembodied? If Saruman had the ring and he learned to master it, he could rule Sauron's armies and servants as it says in The Fellowship Of The Ring. For a moment it wavered, looking to the West; but out of the . Follow her on Twitter and Instagram. Gandalf - open displays of power versus his restrictions as an Istar. Today we jump back in time to one of our older videos at one of our What If scenarios! Saruman had full control of his army, which is why the Hobbits were being brought to him (because they maybe had the ring), instead of immediately to Sauron (who at the time of their capture, they were much closer to). Science Fiction & Fantasy Stack Exchange is a question and answer site for science fiction and fantasy enthusiasts. The Ring still wants to be with its true master. Two Blue Wizards went with Saruman into the East. It would have been the master in the end. My own feeling is that since it takes time to learn to master the Ring (also Letter 246), Sauron would have had to pay a visit immediately and before Saruman had the time to achieve this mastery. Saruman would have made a tasty little morsel for Sauron. It seems it was a mistake for the Ring to leave Isildur. Out of these, the cookies that are categorized as necessary are stored on your browser as they are essential for the working of basic functionalities of the website. The chapter is a partly published version of a manuscript now held at the Marquette University (MSS 4/2/31-37); [1] other parts of this manuscript and a time scheme have been included in The . Answer (1 of 3): In short: nobody else could use it against him. Saruman is my favorite figure of all time . We know that disobedience can bring ruin such as what happened with the Noldor when they disobeyed the Valar or the Army of the Dead when they disobeyed Isildur and broke their oath to fight for him. Short story taking place on a toroidal planet or moon involving flying, Acidity of alcohols and basicity of amines, The difference between the phonemes /p/ and /b/ in Japanese, Replacing broken pins/legs on a DIP IC package. After all, he was extremely powerful in his own right. It basically lets them look unique according to their enchantment. Keep in mind the Ring doesn't only have Sauron's power in it. cbr.com - Blake Hawkins 14h. Could he really do anything with it? They'd be capable of wielding it and would be a threat to Sauron, though Sauron would probably win in the end as The Ring was only . Saruman summon the storm on Caradhras in the PJverse in The Fellowship of the Ring. What would have happened if Saruman got the ring? Saruman would have made a tasty little morsel for Sauron. I would have thought that they would have been used against Sauron if at all possible while he didnt have the one. Sauron was the master ring-maker in LOTR, but Saruman also forged a ring of power so that he could eventually challenge the Dark Lord. Rohan would've fallen to Saruman and wouldn't have been able to come to the aid of Gondor and helped make the final stand against the forces of Mordor at the Black Gate. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Hidden realms of elves in the past had undone the plans of Morgoth himself, and Sauron was not likely to let such a thing go unchallenged. I would think that Saruman, a Maia, would be in that category. Be specific and add in your sources, we prefer not to have speculation here. 2 What would happen if Gandalf had the ring? Does he use his great voice, enhanced by the One to subjugate the free peoples. Even still, Frodo set the benchmark for hope and volunteered to take the One Ring to Mordor, where he destroyed it and saved the world from disaster. Since both are immortal, Saruman is going to be tortured for a long, long, long, long, LONG time. The Three were used against Sauron, but indirectly. The first and most obvious reason Galadriel gets to hang on to her Ring - Nenya, the Ring of Water - from beginning (i.e. By clicking Accept All, you consent to the use of ALL the cookies. It has been suggested that the reason why Saruman lost access to magic after the . As with Gandalf or Galadriel, the Ring would comply with the good intent of their first efforts. Sauron was stronger than Gandalf in the Lord of the Rings, but it has to be said that there were a few different shapes of both characters. We also use third-party cookies that help us analyze and understand how you use this website. That Saruman is nothing like the Stranger who falls from the sky in The Rings of Power. The Lord of the Rings; Middle-Earth (Franchise) entertainment news What is a word for the arcane equivalent of a monastery? Gandalf was hand-selected and sent by Manw. The images have been re-edited so I hope you enjoy! We learn that Denethor, steward of Gondor, had used the Palantir to divine knowledge of the Enemys movements only just before the steward burns himself alive. His three friends were smiling at him, but Gandalf was only managing an embarrassed smile towards the Lady. Saruman later describes himself as "Ring-maker" when taunting Gandalf. Amy Ratcliffe is the Editor-in-Chief for Nerdist and the author ofStar Wars: Women of the Galaxy, The Art of Star Wars: Galaxys Edge, The Jedi Mind, and more. My understanding of the crushingly unavoidable fate which is the history of Middle Earth says that the One Ring belongs to Sauron and no other. Its probably been done already, and if so I apologize, but: If Saruman had gotten his greedy lil mitts on the one ring, would he have been able to set himself up as a new dark lord (or however they call themselves)? But there are important differences between Saruman's position, if he had taken the Ring in Isengard, and Frodo's position when he claimed the Ring in Mordor. He now lives with his family in Lynchburg VA and is an avid outdoorsman. At the same time, most of the Elves were leaving Middle-earth, and Saruman betrayed everyone and joined Sauron. The Lord of the Rings is one of the best series of three fantasy adventure films, The Fellowship of the Ring (2001), The Two Towers (2002), and The Return of the King (2003), directed by Peter Jackson, based on the novel which was written by J. R. R. Tolkien.The series is widely regarded as the greatest and the most influential, it was also a huge success financially and is among the highest . If any being who had the power to use the Ring to its full potential had gotten ahold of it, that being would have been able to easily take on Sauron. The Rings of Power finale took viewers on a ride with solved mysteries, reunions, and goodbyes. This mod, although it doesn't add a new staff to the game, creates a unique design for all of the Skyrim staves. What would have happened if Saruman had gotten his hands on the One Ring? I got down on bended knee at the top of the mountain and proposed. What money is available for senior citizens? Sauron is the primary villain of The Lord Of The Rings. Again Aragorn refuses it, apparently without any internal struggle whatsoever. Then Sauron would have had the ring again and either he'd keep Saruman as a servant or just get rid of him for trying to be his equal. Tolkiens trilogy its even plastered on the cover of several editions of the books. Two Maiar duking it out at their full strength would have brought ruin to much of Middle-earth, and that was exactly what the Valar had hoped to avoid in the first place. Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for LEGO The Lord of the Rings Tower of Orthanc (10237) at the best online prices at eBay! Got caught and lost a mind-to-mind battle. See Palantr Wikipedia . The heroes in The Lord of the Rings did everything to keep the One Ring away from Sauron, but what would have happened if Saruman had gotten it? Yet, he had . This is the real reason the eagles question will never die: Its too appetizing for The Lord of the Rings fans. Too well studied, as it turned out, for Saruman gradually turned to evil himself, emulating Sauron's works. Who controlled the Seeing Stone of Minas Anor? He did not fear Sauron, but rather was forbidden to contest with him directly. On the other hand, if the Stranger is Saruman, consider that journey and how it makes his transformation all the more tragic. Not true. When it comes to the Stranger, played by Daniel Weyman, we learned he is one of the Istari, but we did not learn his actual name. You would have a situation where Saruman knows exactly where the Ringbearer is headed and Sauron knowing Saruman is suspiciously concentrated on the area from Parth Galen to the Black Gate. Gil Galad, and the last alliance also defeated Sauron, without the help of the Maiar, as well. He could turn invisible and go slowly crazy, which seem to be the width of the one ring's powers. Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience.